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	<title>Comments on: Tiger Escapes SF Zoo, Kills One</title>
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		<title>By: Loren Coleman</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/comment-page-1/#comment-38530</link>
		<dc:creator>Loren Coleman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Dec 2007 14:43:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/#comment-38530</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[For a December 31, 2007, update, on the tiger attack, see especially the last half of this posting:

&lt;b&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/zoos-news-07/&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Year Ends With Zoos in News&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/b&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For a December 31, 2007, update, on the tiger attack, see especially the last half of this posting:</p>
<p><b><a href="http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/zoos-news-07/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Year Ends With Zoos in News</a></b></p>
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		<title>By: Mnynames</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/comment-page-1/#comment-38529</link>
		<dc:creator>Mnynames</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Dec 2007 16:03:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[I caught something about the fence only being 12 feet tall, and most tiger enclosures have 16-foot fences, but I too heard that it would be practically impossible for the tiger to escape on its own.  Never underestimate a pissed-off tiger, I guess.  The news report I watched said that a shoeprint was found on the fence itself, and a shoe in the moat, along with a great many rocks and pine cones which may have been thrown at the poor tiger.  Ugh.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I caught something about the fence only being 12 feet tall, and most tiger enclosures have 16-foot fences, but I too heard that it would be practically impossible for the tiger to escape on its own.  Never underestimate a pissed-off tiger, I guess.  The news report I watched said that a shoeprint was found on the fence itself, and a shoe in the moat, along with a great many rocks and pine cones which may have been thrown at the poor tiger.  Ugh.</p>
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		<title>By: DARHOP</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/comment-page-1/#comment-38528</link>
		<dc:creator>DARHOP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Dec 2007 17:42:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/#comment-38528</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[What a tragic situation. I agree, I think there is more to it than the cat just escaping her enclosure. I read this morning that Jack Hannah said it would be pretty impossible for the cat to have escaped its enclosure on its own. I guess there is a 20 ft. moat around it. Tigers can swim though I&#039;m pretty sure.

I read the other day about a tiger in a zoo in china. It was killed right in her pen. Killed for her hide. They skinned her, right in her pen at the zoo. Now that is unbelievable. What is wrong with some people? Really.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What a tragic situation. I agree, I think there is more to it than the cat just escaping her enclosure. I read this morning that Jack Hannah said it would be pretty impossible for the cat to have escaped its enclosure on its own. I guess there is a 20 ft. moat around it. Tigers can swim though I&#8217;m pretty sure.</p>
<p>I read the other day about a tiger in a zoo in china. It was killed right in her pen. Killed for her hide. They skinned her, right in her pen at the zoo. Now that is unbelievable. What is wrong with some people? Really.</p>
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		<title>By: Mnynames</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/comment-page-1/#comment-38527</link>
		<dc:creator>Mnynames</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Dec 2007 03:39:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/#comment-38527</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think most zoos are definitely getting better.  I can remember going to the Cape May County Zoo in South Jersey, a pretty big zoo for the area, but a small one overall.  When I first went many years ago, I nearly cried upon seeing the big cats pacing back and forth on the concrete slab floors of their tiny chain-link fence cages.  It was even sadder to look around and realize I was the only one out of the crowd who thought anything was wrong.  I went back years later, and was quite pleased to see that both the lions and the tiger had their own enclosures, each of which could easily hold about 20 of their previous cages, and signs were even in place warning people to not provoke the tiger with baby strollers (I don&#039;t know if this is a tiger thing, or a personal thing for that tiger, but she liked to stalk them and was apparently irritated by the noise of their wheels.  I imagine Kittenz might know the answer to that peculiarity).  Today, Cape May Zoo is one I would recommend to anyone.

Kittenz, you are probably right there about the tranq gun.  Still may have been possible if they could have cordoned off the area, but obviously that was not the situation.  As I said, it sounds from the reports like it was heading for a group of people, and I shuddered too to think of what it might have done.  Take any group of people and throw a tiger into the mix (And an obviously irritated one, at that), and you will have mass and immediate panic.  Even if it was the sweetest putty tat imaginable, their instincts will still kick in when faced with a dozen running, screaming potential prey items, even if it&#039;s just to shut them up.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think most zoos are definitely getting better.  I can remember going to the Cape May County Zoo in South Jersey, a pretty big zoo for the area, but a small one overall.  When I first went many years ago, I nearly cried upon seeing the big cats pacing back and forth on the concrete slab floors of their tiny chain-link fence cages.  It was even sadder to look around and realize I was the only one out of the crowd who thought anything was wrong.  I went back years later, and was quite pleased to see that both the lions and the tiger had their own enclosures, each of which could easily hold about 20 of their previous cages, and signs were even in place warning people to not provoke the tiger with baby strollers (I don&#8217;t know if this is a tiger thing, or a personal thing for that tiger, but she liked to stalk them and was apparently irritated by the noise of their wheels.  I imagine Kittenz might know the answer to that peculiarity).  Today, Cape May Zoo is one I would recommend to anyone.</p>
<p>Kittenz, you are probably right there about the tranq gun.  Still may have been possible if they could have cordoned off the area, but obviously that was not the situation.  As I said, it sounds from the reports like it was heading for a group of people, and I shuddered too to think of what it might have done.  Take any group of people and throw a tiger into the mix (And an obviously irritated one, at that), and you will have mass and immediate panic.  Even if it was the sweetest putty tat imaginable, their instincts will still kick in when faced with a dozen running, screaming potential prey items, even if it&#8217;s just to shut them up.</p>
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		<title>By: mystery_man</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/comment-page-1/#comment-38526</link>
		<dc:creator>mystery_man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Dec 2007 02:26:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/#comment-38526</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[MatteBille- Very well said. You took the words right out of my mouth.

Mnynames- Also well said. I agree completely. I think a well designed zoo can be really quite indispensable for educational purposes as well as for conservation measures, and there is no better way to make people care than by seeing these creatures for themselves. Zoos are a great way to educate people as well as instill a sense of the need to conserve these animals because the zoo lets people see some of these fantastic creatures that they would have never had a chance to see otherwise and this can make a big difference from seeing pictures in books. The zoo is one of my favorite destinations for taking my high school biology students as seeing these things for themselves can teach an enormous amount about animals, evolution, the environment, and the importance of conservation more than I could convey through mere words.

All zoos are indeed not equal, and it breaks my heart when I hear about the ones where conditions for the animals are abysmal. I don&#039;t know how some have been allowed to go on as long as they have. However I do think in this day and age, at least in the States and in Japan, the general trend tends to be that zoos are getting better, so that gives me something to hope for.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MatteBille- Very well said. You took the words right out of my mouth.</p>
<p>Mnynames- Also well said. I agree completely. I think a well designed zoo can be really quite indispensable for educational purposes as well as for conservation measures, and there is no better way to make people care than by seeing these creatures for themselves. Zoos are a great way to educate people as well as instill a sense of the need to conserve these animals because the zoo lets people see some of these fantastic creatures that they would have never had a chance to see otherwise and this can make a big difference from seeing pictures in books. The zoo is one of my favorite destinations for taking my high school biology students as seeing these things for themselves can teach an enormous amount about animals, evolution, the environment, and the importance of conservation more than I could convey through mere words.</p>
<p>All zoos are indeed not equal, and it breaks my heart when I hear about the ones where conditions for the animals are abysmal. I don&#8217;t know how some have been allowed to go on as long as they have. However I do think in this day and age, at least in the States and in Japan, the general trend tends to be that zoos are getting better, so that gives me something to hope for.</p>
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		<title>By: kittenz</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/comment-page-1/#comment-38525</link>
		<dc:creator>kittenz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Dec 2007 02:17:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/#comment-38525</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[As it turns out, it was teenagers that the tiger attacked, and it&#039;s possible, though not proven, that they may have been provoking the tigers and possibly were even involved in the &quot;escape&quot; (which investigators suspect was a release instead of an actual escape).

What the situation sounds like, to me, is a group of young men who maybe somehow were privy to inside information about the zoo, maybe some of them had worked there or something. Anyway maybe they knew how to open the enclosure. But what they did not count on was the immense strength and speed of an angry tiger. The dead boy was killed right outside the tiger&#039;s enclosure, and then the tigress ran a few hundred feet to a cafe where it mauled two more teenaged boys. Some people are saying that those two boys were seen taunting the tigress. How did the tigress come to run to THAT place and attack THOSE boys? I think that maybe she chased them there after they let her out of her habitat. Just conjecture on my part, but sounds as plausible as anything else I have heard. I did hear on the news this evening that the zoo is now being treated as a crime scene, not an accident site.

None of that, whether it&#039;s true or not, absolves the zoo&#039;s responsibility for this awful incident. They should have had better security and emergency measures in place; the tigress should never have been able to escape or to be released by unauthorized people in the first place.

Once the tigress was out, it became imperative to keep her from getting into the general crowd of zoo visitors. I hate it that the tigress had to be killed, but I think of what it would be like, to have that angry 350 lb. cat loose in a mixed crowd of panicked people, and I shudder. What would I feel if that cat attacked me? Or worse yet, my little grandson, or my grandmother? What if there was a class of children there on a field trip? Most people do not know how to behave around wild animals under the best of circumstances, let alone when they are in a panicky crowd confronted with a disoriented, agitated full grown tigress.

Sedating the tiger was not a viable option in this case; the risk to public safety was too great. If the tigress had escaped outside public hours, at night, for instance, and the escape had been discovered, then the zoo personnel could have sedated the tigress and gotten her safely back into her enclosure. But to try to sedate her under the circumstances that occurred Christmas day would have been a terrible risk to take. A partially sedated cat is an extremely dangerous animal with all its predatory behaviors intact and no inhibitions whatsoever. A tiger does not have to actually maul a person to do serious damage; they can kill a cow with a swipe of a paw. What one could do in a crowd of people is too awful to contemplate.

What a tragic waste of two lives.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As it turns out, it was teenagers that the tiger attacked, and it&#8217;s possible, though not proven, that they may have been provoking the tigers and possibly were even involved in the &#8220;escape&#8221; (which investigators suspect was a release instead of an actual escape).</p>
<p>What the situation sounds like, to me, is a group of young men who maybe somehow were privy to inside information about the zoo, maybe some of them had worked there or something. Anyway maybe they knew how to open the enclosure. But what they did not count on was the immense strength and speed of an angry tiger. The dead boy was killed right outside the tiger&#8217;s enclosure, and then the tigress ran a few hundred feet to a cafe where it mauled two more teenaged boys. Some people are saying that those two boys were seen taunting the tigress. How did the tigress come to run to THAT place and attack THOSE boys? I think that maybe she chased them there after they let her out of her habitat. Just conjecture on my part, but sounds as plausible as anything else I have heard. I did hear on the news this evening that the zoo is now being treated as a crime scene, not an accident site.</p>
<p>None of that, whether it&#8217;s true or not, absolves the zoo&#8217;s responsibility for this awful incident. They should have had better security and emergency measures in place; the tigress should never have been able to escape or to be released by unauthorized people in the first place.</p>
<p>Once the tigress was out, it became imperative to keep her from getting into the general crowd of zoo visitors. I hate it that the tigress had to be killed, but I think of what it would be like, to have that angry 350 lb. cat loose in a mixed crowd of panicked people, and I shudder. What would I feel if that cat attacked me? Or worse yet, my little grandson, or my grandmother? What if there was a class of children there on a field trip? Most people do not know how to behave around wild animals under the best of circumstances, let alone when they are in a panicky crowd confronted with a disoriented, agitated full grown tigress.</p>
<p>Sedating the tiger was not a viable option in this case; the risk to public safety was too great. If the tigress had escaped outside public hours, at night, for instance, and the escape had been discovered, then the zoo personnel could have sedated the tigress and gotten her safely back into her enclosure. But to try to sedate her under the circumstances that occurred Christmas day would have been a terrible risk to take. A partially sedated cat is an extremely dangerous animal with all its predatory behaviors intact and no inhibitions whatsoever. A tiger does not have to actually maul a person to do serious damage; they can kill a cow with a swipe of a paw. What one could do in a crowd of people is too awful to contemplate.</p>
<p>What a tragic waste of two lives.</p>
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		<title>By: Mnynames</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/comment-page-1/#comment-38524</link>
		<dc:creator>Mnynames</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Dec 2007 00:31:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/#comment-38524</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This question about animal captivity and exhibition has come up more than once in my former career in an aquarium, and my answer is the same I give about why field trips for children are so important as well- If people don&#039;t see these animals and environments, they will not care for (or about) them.  Period.  End of sentence.  More than being the ones responsible for breeding programs for various species, zoos and aquaria are educational centers, spreading word, and with it concern, of these beautiful, priceless species.

Having said that, Loren is quite right in saying that not all are equal, and some should never be allowed to remain open, whatever the circumstances (Many small zoos can quickly turn into animal hoarding situations).  There is also a big difference between a cage and a habitat.  Lastly, I agree that authorities are WAY too quick to slaughter dangerous escaped animals, regardless of whether or not they are endangered, but by the descriptions, this shooting may have been justified, as it was said to be approaching a large group of people.  Why there wasn&#039;t someone on the scene with a tranq gun is the question we should probably be asking.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This question about animal captivity and exhibition has come up more than once in my former career in an aquarium, and my answer is the same I give about why field trips for children are so important as well- If people don&#8217;t see these animals and environments, they will not care for (or about) them.  Period.  End of sentence.  More than being the ones responsible for breeding programs for various species, zoos and aquaria are educational centers, spreading word, and with it concern, of these beautiful, priceless species.</p>
<p>Having said that, Loren is quite right in saying that not all are equal, and some should never be allowed to remain open, whatever the circumstances (Many small zoos can quickly turn into animal hoarding situations).  There is also a big difference between a cage and a habitat.  Lastly, I agree that authorities are WAY too quick to slaughter dangerous escaped animals, regardless of whether or not they are endangered, but by the descriptions, this shooting may have been justified, as it was said to be approaching a large group of people.  Why there wasn&#8217;t someone on the scene with a tranq gun is the question we should probably be asking.</p>
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		<title>By: MattBille</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/comment-page-1/#comment-38523</link>
		<dc:creator>MattBille</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:36:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/#comment-38523</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I can&#039;t imagine giving up on zoos.  They are, in some cases, the sole hope of keeping a species alive.  The Cheyenne Mountain Zoo here in Colorado Springs breeds the very rare Amur leopard and the Mexican wolf, and was important in reviving the black-footed ferret.  Many of these programs would not exist unless supported by zoo admission and membership fees.

In the United States, the proliferation of small zoos with little cages is giving way, albeit slowly, to a developing system where, due to public and scientific pressure, zoos become fewer in number, as those which can provide room and suitable (if sometimes simulated) habitats attract support.  At the spacious, mainly outdoor exhibits for the aforementioned leopard and wolf at Cheyenne Mountain, visitors come even though  they must accept that they may miss seeing a species entirely on any given visit.

At the National Zoo in Washington, DC, I spent quite a while looking at the foliage of the marmoset habitat without a sure sighting, and saw a tiger only at a distance.  There&#039;s a balancing act involved in choosing what animals to put in what habitats: a lot of people would be very upset if they traveled for hours to see the pandas and missed them.  The pandas could do with more room and more animal company, but as long as they are well cared for, the service they perform in saving their species is, I think, worthwhile even though the animal obviously has no choice in it.

This leads into the question of motivating people toward putting their money, effort, and political clout into conservation programs.  I&#039;m not aware of any studies on this topic, but I don&#039;t think that even the most superb wildlife photography (I&#039;m watching &quot;Planet Earth&quot; on DVD as I write this) affects most people emotionally the way personally admiring a tiger or laughing  at a playful orangutan a few yards away does.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can&#8217;t imagine giving up on zoos.  They are, in some cases, the sole hope of keeping a species alive.  The Cheyenne Mountain Zoo here in Colorado Springs breeds the very rare Amur leopard and the Mexican wolf, and was important in reviving the black-footed ferret.  Many of these programs would not exist unless supported by zoo admission and membership fees.</p>
<p>In the United States, the proliferation of small zoos with little cages is giving way, albeit slowly, to a developing system where, due to public and scientific pressure, zoos become fewer in number, as those which can provide room and suitable (if sometimes simulated) habitats attract support.  At the spacious, mainly outdoor exhibits for the aforementioned leopard and wolf at Cheyenne Mountain, visitors come even though  they must accept that they may miss seeing a species entirely on any given visit.</p>
<p>At the National Zoo in Washington, DC, I spent quite a while looking at the foliage of the marmoset habitat without a sure sighting, and saw a tiger only at a distance.  There&#8217;s a balancing act involved in choosing what animals to put in what habitats: a lot of people would be very upset if they traveled for hours to see the pandas and missed them.  The pandas could do with more room and more animal company, but as long as they are well cared for, the service they perform in saving their species is, I think, worthwhile even though the animal obviously has no choice in it.</p>
<p>This leads into the question of motivating people toward putting their money, effort, and political clout into conservation programs.  I&#8217;m not aware of any studies on this topic, but I don&#8217;t think that even the most superb wildlife photography (I&#8217;m watching &#8220;Planet Earth&#8221; on DVD as I write this) affects most people emotionally the way personally admiring a tiger or laughing  at a playful orangutan a few yards away does.</p>
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		<title>By: Loren Coleman</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/comment-page-1/#comment-38522</link>
		<dc:creator>Loren Coleman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:35:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/#comment-38522</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thoughtful zoos do establish breeding programs to preserve rare and nearly extinct species.

Some zoos should not be open.

All zoos are not equal.

The capture and observation of Bigfoot in a progressive zoo would be the way I would prefer to prove they exist rather that killing the first one accepted by zoology.

&lt;em&gt;King Kong&lt;/em&gt; is an imagined story and movie, and bringing that piece of fiction up seems a bit out of place in this discussion.  Considering that a tiger and person died, what does the suffering of a fictional character have to do with anything here?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thoughtful zoos do establish breeding programs to preserve rare and nearly extinct species.</p>
<p>Some zoos should not be open.</p>
<p>All zoos are not equal.</p>
<p>The capture and observation of Bigfoot in a progressive zoo would be the way I would prefer to prove they exist rather that killing the first one accepted by zoology.</p>
<p><em>King Kong</em> is an imagined story and movie, and bringing that piece of fiction up seems a bit out of place in this discussion.  Considering that a tiger and person died, what does the suffering of a fictional character have to do with anything here?</p>
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		<title>By: captiannemo</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/comment-page-1/#comment-38521</link>
		<dc:creator>captiannemo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:02:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/tiger-escapes-sf-zoo-kills-one/#comment-38521</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The idea of turning an animal that has lost  it&#039;s fear of man back into the wild is also a mistake,
A result that could be even more tragic for man and beast alike.
The Ghost and the Darkness.......no fear!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The idea of turning an animal that has lost  it&#8217;s fear of man back into the wild is also a mistake,<br />
A result that could be even more tragic for man and beast alike.<br />
The Ghost and the Darkness&#8230;&#8230;.no fear!</p>
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