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	<title>Comments on: Loch Ness Monsters and Novembers</title>
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	<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/lnm-nov/</link>
	<description>for Bigfoot, Lake Monsters, Sea Serpents and More</description>
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		<title>By: bobhelferstay</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/lnm-nov/comment-page-1/#comment-74696</link>
		<dc:creator>bobhelferstay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Nov 2011 17:57:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/?p=47991#comment-74696</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think that what people are seeing in the Loch are things like logs, lake sturgeon, seals, boat wakes...  things along those lines. Its location causes a lot of optical illusions.  

If there were a breeding population of large creatures in that lake, or even coming in to that lake, I think we would have found it by now. One would have washed up on shore, or been caught in fishing nets, or something. 

People really do believe they are seeing a monster. Most I&#039;m sure are not lying. But what they are seeing are simply things they are misidentifying.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that what people are seeing in the Loch are things like logs, lake sturgeon, seals, boat wakes&#8230;  things along those lines. Its location causes a lot of optical illusions.  </p>
<p>If there were a breeding population of large creatures in that lake, or even coming in to that lake, I think we would have found it by now. One would have washed up on shore, or been caught in fishing nets, or something. </p>
<p>People really do believe they are seeing a monster. Most I&#8217;m sure are not lying. But what they are seeing are simply things they are misidentifying.</p>
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		<title>By: wuffing</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/lnm-nov/comment-page-1/#comment-74630</link>
		<dc:creator>wuffing</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Nov 2011 20:53:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/?p=47991#comment-74630</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[bobhelferstay asked &lt;i&gt;&quot; aren’t the two entrances to Loch Ness from the ocean very shallow, making it hard for something to enter and exit without being seen?&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

One route, via the Caledonian Canal, is OK for fish if they are feeling lucky. Loch Ness is 52 feet above sea level so there are quite a few lock-gates to pass through. There&#039;s no way large unknown animals will slip through unnoticed.

The other one is the River Ness which is the natural overflow from the lake. There are several weirs and shallow rapid sections, and the river is generally 50 to 100 yards wide but only a few feet deep. Seals get into the lake this way. Some sections are easily observed as it flows through the centre of Inverness city.
There&#039;s a &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.lochnessinvestigation.com/RiverNessJourney.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;webpage&lt;/a&gt; on Dick Raynor&#039;s site that shows some of it - and there&#039;s always GoogleEarth and Streetview.

On another point - the &quot;ocean&quot;, the Inverness and Beauly Firths, where the River Ness and the canal meet salt water is itself very shallow, only a few metres deep for several miles, and has been fished, netted and speared for thousands of years. There are no records of monsters being caught.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bobhelferstay asked <i>&#8221; aren’t the two entrances to Loch Ness from the ocean very shallow, making it hard for something to enter and exit without being seen?&#8221;</i></p>
<p>One route, via the Caledonian Canal, is OK for fish if they are feeling lucky. Loch Ness is 52 feet above sea level so there are quite a few lock-gates to pass through. There&#8217;s no way large unknown animals will slip through unnoticed.</p>
<p>The other one is the River Ness which is the natural overflow from the lake. There are several weirs and shallow rapid sections, and the river is generally 50 to 100 yards wide but only a few feet deep. Seals get into the lake this way. Some sections are easily observed as it flows through the centre of Inverness city.<br />
There&#8217;s a <a href="http://www.lochnessinvestigation.com/RiverNessJourney.html" rel="nofollow">webpage</a> on Dick Raynor&#8217;s site that shows some of it &#8211; and there&#8217;s always GoogleEarth and Streetview.</p>
<p>On another point &#8211; the &#8220;ocean&#8221;, the Inverness and Beauly Firths, where the River Ness and the canal meet salt water is itself very shallow, only a few metres deep for several miles, and has been fished, netted and speared for thousands of years. There are no records of monsters being caught.</p>
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		<title>By: bobhelferstay</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/lnm-nov/comment-page-1/#comment-74608</link>
		<dc:creator>bobhelferstay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Nov 2011 15:35:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/?p=47991#comment-74608</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[wuffing, I didn&#039;t know that about the echolocation in Lake Champlain never being duplicated, and that they were using equipment that they were not familiar with. Again, I saw it on MonsterQuest, and I guess they tend to leave out little details like that. 

It&#039;s hard to say if anything is visiting Loch Ness. I&#039;ve seen a lot of theories as to what the creatures could be. Some are better than others. 

I&#039;m sure there are millions of creatures in the oceans, and even in lakes that have yet to be discovered. It would be interesting to drain the lake and see what&#039;s there once and for all. Not possible, I know. But I think that&#039;s the only way to really know for sure. 

Also, aren&#039;t the two entrances to Loch Ness from the ocean very shallow, making it hard for something to enter and exit without being seen?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>wuffing, I didn&#8217;t know that about the echolocation in Lake Champlain never being duplicated, and that they were using equipment that they were not familiar with. Again, I saw it on MonsterQuest, and I guess they tend to leave out little details like that. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s hard to say if anything is visiting Loch Ness. I&#8217;ve seen a lot of theories as to what the creatures could be. Some are better than others. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure there are millions of creatures in the oceans, and even in lakes that have yet to be discovered. It would be interesting to drain the lake and see what&#8217;s there once and for all. Not possible, I know. But I think that&#8217;s the only way to really know for sure. </p>
<p>Also, aren&#8217;t the two entrances to Loch Ness from the ocean very shallow, making it hard for something to enter and exit without being seen?</p>
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		<title>By: wuffing</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/lnm-nov/comment-page-1/#comment-74594</link>
		<dc:creator>wuffing</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Nov 2011 01:06:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/?p=47991#comment-74594</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Bobhelferstay wrote &quot;&lt;i&gt;Personally, I’m of the mind that there is nothing in Loch Ness. I used to believe, but it’s been looked at for so long that if there were a colony of large unknown creatures there, they would have been found by now. 

Now this does not discount creatures in other lakes. In Lake Champlain they pick up echo location signals, and there is nothing known in that lake that uses echo location. So there is more evidence that something unknown is living there.&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

My response to the first part is that Bob is probably correct, with the emphasis on &quot;colony of large unknown creatures&quot;, but I think there could be some seasonally active fish awaiting detection in the loch. There are of course seals, eels and salmonids visiting the loch from the sea. As for the echo-location in Champlain, &quot;something&quot; was detected by a team on three occasions during a film shoot eight years ago, but they were using unfamiliar equipment in an unfamiliar environment, outside their normal area of expertise, without any control experiments, and the results have never been repeated. An untested daisy-chain of detectors, processors and recorders all running off a boat inverter is a recipe for harmonic mayhem.  If the scientific community really thought there were animals echo-locating in the lake the place would be crawling with post-grad zoologists looking for their Ph.D. 

&quot;&lt;i&gt;and there is nothing known in that lake that uses echo location&quot;&lt;/i&gt; - true, apart from dozens of boats.

Just my thoughts.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bobhelferstay wrote &#8220;<i>Personally, I’m of the mind that there is nothing in Loch Ness. I used to believe, but it’s been looked at for so long that if there were a colony of large unknown creatures there, they would have been found by now. </p>
<p>Now this does not discount creatures in other lakes. In Lake Champlain they pick up echo location signals, and there is nothing known in that lake that uses echo location. So there is more evidence that something unknown is living there.&#8221;</i></p>
<p>My response to the first part is that Bob is probably correct, with the emphasis on &#8220;colony of large unknown creatures&#8221;, but I think there could be some seasonally active fish awaiting detection in the loch. There are of course seals, eels and salmonids visiting the loch from the sea. As for the echo-location in Champlain, &#8220;something&#8221; was detected by a team on three occasions during a film shoot eight years ago, but they were using unfamiliar equipment in an unfamiliar environment, outside their normal area of expertise, without any control experiments, and the results have never been repeated. An untested daisy-chain of detectors, processors and recorders all running off a boat inverter is a recipe for harmonic mayhem.  If the scientific community really thought there were animals echo-locating in the lake the place would be crawling with post-grad zoologists looking for their Ph.D. </p>
<p>&#8220;<i>and there is nothing known in that lake that uses echo location&#8221;</i> &#8211; true, apart from dozens of boats.</p>
<p>Just my thoughts.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: bobhelferstay</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/lnm-nov/comment-page-1/#comment-74575</link>
		<dc:creator>bobhelferstay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Nov 2011 16:08:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/?p=47991#comment-74575</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Lyall M, maybe it was just a interpretation that MonsterQuest did. I personally don&#039;t see anything in the photo. It could be anything, so I dismiss it. 

For me, it&#039;s hard to take photographic evidence of anything. It&#039;s so easy to fake photos. Especially now a days. And look at the surgeons photo. It fooled everyone for decades, and it was nothing but a toy submarine. 

Personally, I&#039;m of the mind that there is nothing in Loch Ness. I used to believe, but it&#039;s been looked at for so long that if there were a colony of large unknown creatures there, they would have been found by now. 

Now this does not discount creatures in other lakes. In Lake Champlain they pick up echo location signals, and there is nothing known in that lake that uses echo location. So there is more evidence that something unknown is living there.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lyall M, maybe it was just a interpretation that MonsterQuest did. I personally don&#8217;t see anything in the photo. It could be anything, so I dismiss it. </p>
<p>For me, it&#8217;s hard to take photographic evidence of anything. It&#8217;s so easy to fake photos. Especially now a days. And look at the surgeons photo. It fooled everyone for decades, and it was nothing but a toy submarine. </p>
<p>Personally, I&#8217;m of the mind that there is nothing in Loch Ness. I used to believe, but it&#8217;s been looked at for so long that if there were a colony of large unknown creatures there, they would have been found by now. </p>
<p>Now this does not discount creatures in other lakes. In Lake Champlain they pick up echo location signals, and there is nothing known in that lake that uses echo location. So there is more evidence that something unknown is living there.</p>
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		<title>By: bobhelferstay</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/lnm-nov/comment-page-1/#comment-74555</link>
		<dc:creator>bobhelferstay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Nov 2011 21:47:57 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[The body is in the water. The dog is swimming.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The body is in the water. The dog is swimming.</p>
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		<title>By: Lyall M</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/lnm-nov/comment-page-1/#comment-74548</link>
		<dc:creator>Lyall M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Nov 2011 17:20:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/?p=47991#comment-74548</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[What you saw was a drawing of a person’s interpretation of what they saw in the photo. It was not a computer clean up based only on algorithms to determine lightness/darkness/shake etc.  One of the dog creation series is here:

http://www.buzzfeed.com/mathieus/loch-ness-monster-was-a-dog-8q4
 
I always thought the 1934 BBC films of the “monster” swimming in the rain actually showed a sturgeon swimming at the surface. Gray’s photo seems too indistinct to characterize.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What you saw was a drawing of a person’s interpretation of what they saw in the photo. It was not a computer clean up based only on algorithms to determine lightness/darkness/shake etc.  One of the dog creation series is here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.buzzfeed.com/mathieus/loch-ness-monster-was-a-dog-8q4" rel="nofollow">http://www.buzzfeed.com/mathieus/loch-ness-monster-was-a-dog-8q4</a></p>
<p>I always thought the 1934 BBC films of the “monster” swimming in the rain actually showed a sturgeon swimming at the surface. Gray’s photo seems too indistinct to characterize.</p>
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		<title>By: silverity</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/lnm-nov/comment-page-1/#comment-74546</link>
		<dc:creator>silverity</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Nov 2011 10:24:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/?p=47991#comment-74546</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#039;s not a dog for one simple reason - where&#039;s the body?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s not a dog for one simple reason &#8211; where&#8217;s the body?</p>
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		<title>By: wuffing</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/lnm-nov/comment-page-1/#comment-74545</link>
		<dc:creator>wuffing</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Nov 2011 09:23:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/?p=47991#comment-74545</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Bobhelferstay wrote &quot;History channel put the photo back in to focus. &quot;  
Good old History Channel - but when I look closely I see that the photo is actually sharp, but a double exposure, with evidence of retouched water in the top right quadrant which in some versions is a dark reflection of something in the background.
This suggests to me that the photo was not taken where it was claimed and therefore an intentional prank. Common at Loch Ness, I believe.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bobhelferstay wrote &#8220;History channel put the photo back in to focus. &#8221;<br />
Good old History Channel &#8211; but when I look closely I see that the photo is actually sharp, but a double exposure, with evidence of retouched water in the top right quadrant which in some versions is a dark reflection of something in the background.<br />
This suggests to me that the photo was not taken where it was claimed and therefore an intentional prank. Common at Loch Ness, I believe.</p>
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		<title>By: bobhelferstay</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/lnm-nov/comment-page-1/#comment-74529</link>
		<dc:creator>bobhelferstay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Nov 2011 15:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[The documentary that I saw, I think it was Monsterquest, or something else on the History channel put the photo back in to focus. It&#039;s definitely a dog swimming in the water with a stick in it&#039;s mouth. 

The way I usually deal with photographic evidence is that if it&#039;s not clear and I have to sit there and look at it to figure out what it is, I usually dismiss it. 

As a matter of fact, here in 2011 I don&#039;t put a lot of stock in photographic evidence, since you can no longer really believe what you see in a photograph.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The documentary that I saw, I think it was Monsterquest, or something else on the History channel put the photo back in to focus. It&#8217;s definitely a dog swimming in the water with a stick in it&#8217;s mouth. </p>
<p>The way I usually deal with photographic evidence is that if it&#8217;s not clear and I have to sit there and look at it to figure out what it is, I usually dismiss it. </p>
<p>As a matter of fact, here in 2011 I don&#8217;t put a lot of stock in photographic evidence, since you can no longer really believe what you see in a photograph.</p>
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