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	<title>Comments on: Krantz on Skookum Cast</title>
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	<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/</link>
	<description>for Bigfoot, Lake Monsters, Sea Serpents and More</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: DWA</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/comment-page-1/#comment-26461</link>
		<dc:creator>DWA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2007 17:31:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/#comment-26461</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[thom_powell:

I&#039;d forget about skeptics.  At least about trying to justify anything to them.

Unfortunately for true skepticism, I can say one thing about most - not all, but the vast majority - of people who self-identify as &quot;skeptics&quot; on this topic:  They&#039;re ignorant of the evidence and ignorant of the scientific process.

There are exceptions. (Several of them check in here fairly frequently.)  But they are few.

All the searchers can do is ignore the goofball chorus and focus on gathering the evidence.  More strength to your arms.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>thom_powell:</p>
<p>I&#8217;d forget about skeptics.  At least about trying to justify anything to them.</p>
<p>Unfortunately for true skepticism, I can say one thing about most &#8211; not all, but the vast majority &#8211; of people who self-identify as &#8220;skeptics&#8221; on this topic:  They&#8217;re ignorant of the evidence and ignorant of the scientific process.</p>
<p>There are exceptions. (Several of them check in here fairly frequently.)  But they are few.</p>
<p>All the searchers can do is ignore the goofball chorus and focus on gathering the evidence.  More strength to your arms.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: thom_powell</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/comment-page-1/#comment-26460</link>
		<dc:creator>thom_powell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2007 16:44:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/#comment-26460</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[To all,
Everything Noll said is correct. The Hydrocal was brought up there to give to LeRoy. That&#039;s been explained many times before but it keeps getting swept aside when folks want to reinitiate circular discussions. In addition, I had two bags (50 lbs) of plaster up there as well as all that hydrocal, but it was worthless cuz it doesn&#039;t adhere to the hydrocal. Yes, we had a lot of stuff up there, because it was an expedition.  It should also be noted that we wished we had more.
  I was there for one of the official examinations In Jan, 01, near Rick&#039;s house at the community college in Edmonds, WA. with Grover and Jeff and Esteban and John G.  Krantz slipped out for a smoke (he smoked True&#039;s) I joined him. I asked him what he thought of the cast.  He said (direct quote) &quot;It&#039;s either the real deal or it&#039;s a very good fake.&quot; ( Krantz, Jan, 2001, Edmonds, WA.)
As a &#039;true&#039; scientist (pun intended) Krantz was always guarded in his assesment. As far as the possibilities of fakery, there is none.  I am dead certain it is not a fake.  I can account for every detail of the cast&#039;s origin and the whereabouts of every individual involved (see &#039;The Locals&#039; Chapter 6), but in the end, I stop trying to convince every new wave of skeptics.
And, at this point I care even less what Grover said or thought.  He&#039;s DEAD! Please, could we go with what LIVING experts think. There&#039;s no shortage of informed assesments by living experts.  Dr. Jeff is an infinetly preferable source of information, or Esteban Saramiento, or Schaller, or anyone but dear departed Grover, who&#039;s post-mortem opinions and assesments are quite irrelevant. His work on the sasquatch subject was all but over before the cast originated. He would be the first to point that out. While we were outside smoking, I asked him to inscribe my copy of his book.  In it overleaf of his book he wrote, &quot;To Thom-Everything is in here except the Skookum Cast&quot;
Doesn&#039;t that say it all?
Best to all,
t. powell]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To all,<br />
Everything Noll said is correct. The Hydrocal was brought up there to give to LeRoy. That&#8217;s been explained many times before but it keeps getting swept aside when folks want to reinitiate circular discussions. In addition, I had two bags (50 lbs) of plaster up there as well as all that hydrocal, but it was worthless cuz it doesn&#8217;t adhere to the hydrocal. Yes, we had a lot of stuff up there, because it was an expedition.  It should also be noted that we wished we had more.<br />
  I was there for one of the official examinations In Jan, 01, near Rick&#8217;s house at the community college in Edmonds, WA. with Grover and Jeff and Esteban and John G.  Krantz slipped out for a smoke (he smoked True&#8217;s) I joined him. I asked him what he thought of the cast.  He said (direct quote) &#8220;It&#8217;s either the real deal or it&#8217;s a very good fake.&#8221; ( Krantz, Jan, 2001, Edmonds, WA.)<br />
As a &#8216;true&#8217; scientist (pun intended) Krantz was always guarded in his assesment. As far as the possibilities of fakery, there is none.  I am dead certain it is not a fake.  I can account for every detail of the cast&#8217;s origin and the whereabouts of every individual involved (see &#8216;The Locals&#8217; Chapter 6), but in the end, I stop trying to convince every new wave of skeptics.<br />
And, at this point I care even less what Grover said or thought.  He&#8217;s DEAD! Please, could we go with what LIVING experts think. There&#8217;s no shortage of informed assesments by living experts.  Dr. Jeff is an infinetly preferable source of information, or Esteban Saramiento, or Schaller, or anyone but dear departed Grover, who&#8217;s post-mortem opinions and assesments are quite irrelevant. His work on the sasquatch subject was all but over before the cast originated. He would be the first to point that out. While we were outside smoking, I asked him to inscribe my copy of his book.  In it overleaf of his book he wrote, &#8220;To Thom-Everything is in here except the Skookum Cast&#8221;<br />
Doesn&#8217;t that say it all?<br />
Best to all,<br />
t. powell</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Rick Noll</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/comment-page-1/#comment-26459</link>
		<dc:creator>Rick Noll</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 14:15:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/#comment-26459</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[To address yousawhat! -

There were 13 people on the expedition. Several of them brought their own casting material. I usually carry three 2.5 gallon plastic buckets full (about 75 pounds). Dr. Fish liked how I set these up and asked for me to bring him a 100 pound bag of Hydrocal B-11 as well during the expedition. When I got there, he already got himself some, so he didn&#039;t want it. So, I had 175 pounds in camp.

75 pounds of plaster is not that much, unless you are packing it in, when you consider that a good original Bigfoot track cast should have between 12 and 17 pounds of plaster. Dr. Fish had 25 pounds and added that to the mix. We both were hoping to be able to cast a trackway series during the expedition… not just one track.

The Skookum cast used 175 pounds of my own Hydrocal B-11 and 6 aluminum tent poles. We then added Dr. Fish&#039;s 25 pounds. Other material added towards the end such as POP and Fixall just fell off the back side of the cast. They did not adhere. When making casts with Hydrocal B-11 you use 2/3 plaster and 1/3 water for any given volume of mix… in this instance about 7 pounds of water for each 25 pounds of plaster… about 228 pounds. Of course the 28 pounds of water disappears when the plaster cures.

Detractors of the cast that know very little about it because personalities are really what is at issue for them with it usually start with your type of statement as an argument... they then move on to why how did we get so much plaster out there and the hardened cast back out of the woods and finally on to would an animal sit down like that when they could just reach down and grab what they wanted... thus it all begins again.

325 pounds include the heavy duty tires, steel frame and protective plywood box and bolts encasing the cast, applied months after its making.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To address yousawhat! -</p>
<p>There were 13 people on the expedition. Several of them brought their own casting material. I usually carry three 2.5 gallon plastic buckets full (about 75 pounds). Dr. Fish liked how I set these up and asked for me to bring him a 100 pound bag of Hydrocal B-11 as well during the expedition. When I got there, he already got himself some, so he didn&#8217;t want it. So, I had 175 pounds in camp.</p>
<p>75 pounds of plaster is not that much, unless you are packing it in, when you consider that a good original Bigfoot track cast should have between 12 and 17 pounds of plaster. Dr. Fish had 25 pounds and added that to the mix. We both were hoping to be able to cast a trackway series during the expedition… not just one track.</p>
<p>The Skookum cast used 175 pounds of my own Hydrocal B-11 and 6 aluminum tent poles. We then added Dr. Fish&#8217;s 25 pounds. Other material added towards the end such as POP and Fixall just fell off the back side of the cast. They did not adhere. When making casts with Hydrocal B-11 you use 2/3 plaster and 1/3 water for any given volume of mix… in this instance about 7 pounds of water for each 25 pounds of plaster… about 228 pounds. Of course the 28 pounds of water disappears when the plaster cures.</p>
<p>Detractors of the cast that know very little about it because personalities are really what is at issue for them with it usually start with your type of statement as an argument&#8230; they then move on to why how did we get so much plaster out there and the hardened cast back out of the woods and finally on to would an animal sit down like that when they could just reach down and grab what they wanted&#8230; thus it all begins again.</p>
<p>325 pounds include the heavy duty tires, steel frame and protective plywood box and bolts encasing the cast, applied months after its making.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: daledrinnon</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/comment-page-1/#comment-26458</link>
		<dc:creator>daledrinnon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 13:25:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/#comment-26458</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[That meant the cast shown on the left of the photo when I said &#039;right hand cast&#039; (sorry, that was anatomical right)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That meant the cast shown on the left of the photo when I said &#8216;right hand cast&#8217; (sorry, that was anatomical right)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: daledrinnon</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/comment-page-1/#comment-26457</link>
		<dc:creator>daledrinnon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 13:23:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/#comment-26457</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I never had any problems with Meldrum&#039;s statements, or Krantz&#039;s. Nor would I believe in ANY piece of evidence simply on somebody else&#039;s say-so.

To me the top of the body in the print (slanted to the upper right corner on the right hand cast) very strongly resembles the head and shoulders of a large gorilla lying down. The scale of the actual print area measures out to me as about three by five feet. Those are just my impressions at this distance.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I never had any problems with Meldrum&#8217;s statements, or Krantz&#8217;s. Nor would I believe in ANY piece of evidence simply on somebody else&#8217;s say-so.</p>
<p>To me the top of the body in the print (slanted to the upper right corner on the right hand cast) very strongly resembles the head and shoulders of a large gorilla lying down. The scale of the actual print area measures out to me as about three by five feet. Those are just my impressions at this distance.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: yousawhat!</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/comment-page-1/#comment-26456</link>
		<dc:creator>yousawhat!</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 02:42:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/#comment-26456</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ve never recovered from these guys having over 325 pounds of casting material on site!  I guess it was a &quot;just in case&quot; thing.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve never recovered from these guys having over 325 pounds of casting material on site!  I guess it was a &#8220;just in case&#8221; thing.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: WingsofCrystal</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/comment-page-1/#comment-26455</link>
		<dc:creator>WingsofCrystal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Feb 2007 00:48:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/#comment-26455</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I just finished your &quot;Bigfoot!&quot; book and it was very good.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just finished your &#8220;Bigfoot!&#8221; book and it was very good.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Lu Ann Lewellen</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/comment-page-1/#comment-26454</link>
		<dc:creator>Lu Ann Lewellen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Feb 2007 21:54:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/#comment-26454</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thank you, colobus. As one who&#039;s been through many debates on the above mentioned forum, all I can say is they don&#039;t hesitate to shoot the messenger, even when the messenger is already dead.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you, colobus. As one who&#8217;s been through many debates on the above mentioned forum, all I can say is they don&#8217;t hesitate to shoot the messenger, even when the messenger is already dead.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: colobus</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/comment-page-1/#comment-26453</link>
		<dc:creator>colobus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Feb 2007 20:13:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/#comment-26453</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The above document written by Grover Krantz was one of six testimonials about the Skookum cast made by professionals who examined it in 2001.

These testimonials were assembled to document various participant opinions regarding the phenominon as a whole, and the Skookum cast in particular, as a possible introduction to the subject for professionals in relevant fields who would be approached to examine the cast.

Many others have copies of these documents, including Jeff Meldrum and Richard Noll, both easily contacted for verification.

It&#039;s a bit surprising that there is any question about Grover&#039;s view on the Skookum cast, as it is well documented both on film, and in writing.  It seems the people doing most of the questioning have not contacted the principals involved in the examintaion of the cast to simply ask them if they knew of any additional documentation of Grover&#039;s views.

Perhaps some feel that if something is not freely available on the internet it does not exist.

As for Bruce Barcott&#039;s statement in Outside Magazine; when Bruce was writing that article Grover was in the final stages of a very painful death.  As people who knew Grover would attest, even when in perfect health he could be cranky.  It seems likely that any conversations he might have had with Mr. Barcott just weeks before his death may have been colored by what he was enduring.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The above document written by Grover Krantz was one of six testimonials about the Skookum cast made by professionals who examined it in 2001.</p>
<p>These testimonials were assembled to document various participant opinions regarding the phenominon as a whole, and the Skookum cast in particular, as a possible introduction to the subject for professionals in relevant fields who would be approached to examine the cast.</p>
<p>Many others have copies of these documents, including Jeff Meldrum and Richard Noll, both easily contacted for verification.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a bit surprising that there is any question about Grover&#8217;s view on the Skookum cast, as it is well documented both on film, and in writing.  It seems the people doing most of the questioning have not contacted the principals involved in the examintaion of the cast to simply ask them if they knew of any additional documentation of Grover&#8217;s views.</p>
<p>Perhaps some feel that if something is not freely available on the internet it does not exist.</p>
<p>As for Bruce Barcott&#8217;s statement in Outside Magazine; when Bruce was writing that article Grover was in the final stages of a very painful death.  As people who knew Grover would attest, even when in perfect health he could be cranky.  It seems likely that any conversations he might have had with Mr. Barcott just weeks before his death may have been colored by what he was enduring.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: DWA</title>
		<link>http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/comment-page-1/#comment-26452</link>
		<dc:creator>DWA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Feb 2007 14:11:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cryptomundo.com/cryptozoo-news/krantz-skookum/#comment-26452</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;p&gt;OK, I understand.  We have the usual problems accruing to a blog for which most of us (quite correctly) recognize the usefulness of anonymity.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;That said:  is there a source for the statement above?  Something we can observe independently of this blog?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Blogs aren&#039;t scientific papers.  We have to live with that.&lt;/p&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK, I understand.  We have the usual problems accruing to a blog for which most of us (quite correctly) recognize the usefulness of anonymity.</p>
<p>That said:  is there a source for the statement above?  Something we can observe independently of this blog?</p>
<p>Blogs aren&#8217;t scientific papers.  We have to live with that.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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