“…they were not to answer any more questions about this site… there would be no more communication about this site… as a matter of fact this site never exisited…!”

(chuckle)

I appreciate that there are a number of potential bigfoot DNA samples now ‘in custody’ but your statement I quote below seems have some unsupported detail. I don’t think we can quote from it until something more than hearsay comes along. Perhaps you have knowledge from personal experience to call upon which could provide some good backing?

”Fresh steaks, intact femurs nearly double the size of a humans, along with several hundred other samples for DNA testing.
Plus having eyewitness living observations associated with half of the samples sounds like more compelling evidence ”

One scenario that might fit the stories about a shot bigfoot is that one has been shot, but the perpetrator is worried about the consequences of what he has done and is feeding a concocted story to the public partly to explore reactions and partly to ease himself into position where he can come and pick up any commercial success he can, without punishment. Meanwhile the body is in cold storage somewhere!

I do agree with you about the value of DNA samples.

No such a thing as an “existence”-nebulous entity of ultimate reality “Science”, or “The Government” or “The Church” as the harbinger of intrinsic Enlightenment,

Just some quantity of human beings doing whatever they decide, who more or less agree and decide on a matter and make something called “Law” which is simply what action they will do to someone who violates their agreement.

Now humans can decide to speculate, see something visually & tag an attempt at describing a cause & effect as Hypothesis, Theory, whatnot & do some close minded or free thinking experiments & writeup on it however they want to spin it. And see if it can be duplicated in the Real World in real time today.

Other than that… why should anyone take the word of self appointed humans as absolute reality?

You may have a point. The point doesn’t matter.

Here’s why:

PROOF IS WHAT SCIENCE SAYS IT IS.

Period.

Science is nowhere near as ‘objective’ as most people, even scientists, will tell you it is.

When science finds fossil skull and bone fragments – Gigantopithecus is “known,” and all the speculation based, on jaw fragments and teeth, and many many species are “known” on less than that – science knows: we ain’t finding anything else, because these are gone now. OK, they may find a complete skeleton, maybe even, you know, a coelacanth, but they know that the odds are extremely against that. So let the speculation begin, with this “knowledge”: we have a skull fragment, well, it looks like one, that looks like it came from an animal that looks like this. We think. Based on the living animals we know about.

That ain’t proof, to me, but it’s good enough for science. Which makes it good enough for me.

Kinda.

“They desire the targeted audience to Believe it & accept it at face value uncritically.” And we pretty much do, because, well, they are SCIENTISTS. And what do we know?

Science will never buy DNA from a species they don’t believe could exist as proof that it does. They have good reason for so doing, just as you could argue they have good reason to shout GO for a skull fragment that may be the only piece we ever find of something. They can’t turn their disbelief on its head for DNA, no more than I can Believe based on somebody’s story of what they saw. Even if the evidence – tons and tons of consistent stories is evidence – says that they may just be right. (Besides: DNA testing can be squirrely, particularly with something unidentified. And scientists know it.)

I hate the extraordinary-claims canard, but this is one place I can sort-of buy it. Science considers this an extraordinary claim and they need a specimen. They just can’t make themselves Believe that there has been all this smoke, all this time, and no fire (that is, no fire that they recognize).

So, they don’t.

I might agree with you. (I have said, and believe, that we have tons more evidence for sasquatch and yeti than we do for most if not all “known” dinosaurs.)

Science, however, disagrees.

And as we have seen: when they think it ain’t real, it ain’t.

Until they say it is.

Unless, of course, you’ve seen one. Be happy. You know they’re ignorant.

I don’t. Yet.

Shouldn’t the scientists and researchers in the scientific field of Cryptozoology be able to do at least as much?

Fresh steaks, intact femurs nearly double the size of a humans, along with several hundred other samples for DNA testing.

Plus having eyewitness living observations associated with half of the samples sounds like more compelling evidence,

Rather than taking the word of someone who just dug up a few mineralized bone fragments in Africa from under the ground with no eyewitness providence of an associated living creature & no DNA evidence.

If you aren’t smart enough to know that “bigfoot DNA” can’t be proven without a confirmed specimen to which to refer, and you don’t have a body, you got nothing.

If you had a body, says here, we’d know.

Next!

Media Blackout desiring elements of the US shadow government/scientism establishment with fellow traveller behind the scenes UN assistance can always apply Aid, projects, World Bank leverage or palm greasing (that’s playin’ nice).

That ever indirectly connected Mr. Lindsay has something to ponder here.

I honestly don’t think may people trust the government now. It started going downhill with Nixon and its kept declining. The last decade (both parties) are a complete fustercluck. So I don’t think the whole ‘did they/did they not’ know about BigFoot will have a huge impact on how the citizenry view the Government (at least in the USA, can’t speak for Canada, haven’t lived there since 5th grade).

As for leaving your 6yo paying in the backyards by the woods, I would hope NO parent would do that now, at least not without a decent, sturdy fence boarding the yard from the woods. I live in a rural, touristy area and just in the last three days I have have groundhogs, raccoon, ducks, deer and hawks within 10 feet of my doors. (Hawk may have been higher, but it took a squirrel right off the line in front of my home, was without phone service for 2 days). If you have ANY idea what is in the woods you don’t let your children unattended, although, honestly, its more likely they’ll be taken by a pedophile than a BF or bear. And its still probably safer than letting them outside to play in Chicago or LA.

As for religion, yeh, some will flip out. Others will come up with excuses like they always do. I can easily see “Descendants of Caine, Unforgiven after the fall” or something to that extent being used by several of the more… lets say charismatic religious leaders to placate their flock.

About humans not being at the top of the food chain? Well, really, we aren’t. We are weak, comparatively frail and, again comparatively, have a slow fertility cycle. We have the ability to use technology and that is the only thing that’s preserved our rather weak butts. We learned to manipulate our environments; make clothing, fire, shelter, the wheel, machinery, now electronics, medicine. If it weren’t for our natural curiosity and love of problem solving we would have been left by the wayside like so many of our evolutionary ‘cousins’. If it weren’t for our inventions the average life expectancy would probably be 25 years.

I don’t think finding out there is another upright primate is going to change that in the slightest. Especially if its somewhat cute. Disneyfication of the animal, good PR (panda, tigers, devils, wolverines) goes a long way in preserving many species. Dolphins are adorable and heaven knows many in the West give generously and will change buying habits to support brands that are ‘dolphin safe’. Same thing for the Panda and preserving its habitat.

The human race is resourceful and resilient and I don’t see too many of us freaking out and starting anarchy over the discovery of a new species. Some will, but then some are just hanging on the edge looking for any excuse to go off the rails.

Again, throughout history there have been numerous documented killings of bigfoot, and im sure scores more that never were reported. It has also been described on numerous occassions, how certain people have covered these up. I mean if we as supporters of things cryptid, including bigfoot, and we are confident that these things do exist, then the government most certainly does know they are here. Afterall if they had no clue, they would have obviously put together a specific governmental scientific study to study the phenomenon of bigfoot sightings and such. Because it would be of great interest to them if a new species was out their. Yet to our knowledge this has never been done, and for good reason, they already know, i mean even if im completely wrong in my assumptions. If the creature does exist, then it is a certainty that a body or body part has crossed the desk of officials involved with the government. It is a certainty.

So alot of people ask why? Why would the gov care at all, why would they be watching Ketchum? What interest could they possibly have?
Well for a moment lets consider the negative hypothesis, that the gov has no clue they are here and a body has never been found. Well in such a case, the gov would be the most interested in seeing the results of the study first. Afterall, before you release news that a potentially aggressive at time, 5 to 12 foot tall animal with beyond human strength, that was rarely seen, and could avoid detection at will, who at least has a small curiosity in children and women, has been living beside humantiy since the dawn of time, you want to make sure their isnt going to be any panic. You would want to know all the consequences of such information being broke, including ecological, political, and religious implications. This could and probably would take an extremely long time, as most people would be dumfounded to know that such an animal has been their without our and the governments knowledge. Therefore, they would have more of an interest in Ketchums work than anyone. This is all under the assumption that the gov has no clue. This also must indicate that if this study is real and that sasquatch samples have been submitted to ketchum, and the gov has no clue of its existence, then the gov must be very sociable in allowing ketchum to have those samples and not take them for themselves. Instead they have decided to be much more sociable and just watch the situation. Again, assuming that the gov has no clue.

So now lets assume that the gov does have knowledge and always has. This would for starters make much more sense. It would explain why the gov would be watching if they truly are. Afterall the gov would care little about results as long as they are but mere rumors, and might as well idly sit back and watch until they figure out just how much evidence has been collected, who collected it, and then just move in before results are published and either allow the study to go through with their blessing, or simply not allow the study to come about. This is what i have thought would happen all along. But this is only my opinion.

So why would they care yet again. Lets start with forestry. If these animals are proven real, the first thing that would be set up is protection for them, this would include habitat protection. This would greatly halt timber removal and clearcutting of their limited habitat, so right their you would have at least controversy, and at most an economical and industrial effect. Then you have religious beliefs. If bigfoot was proven to be related to us and be homo sapien on some level, then the evolutionary claim would have more bite. This would obviously upset religious communities and would at least be controversial. Then youd have the questioning of the gov itself. Afterall if the gov has either hidden this from us forever, or has had no knowledge of it, they both mean the same thing. That if our own gov doesnt know what is living in our woods and fields, especially when it is very large and potentially dangerous, although doubtful, then how can it protect us reliably. It would also make many wonder what else the gov knows that they are hiding. It would put alot of doubt in peoples minds as to what we truly have living in our world, and maybe we arent the dominant species. These are just but a few effects that such a discovery would have. These are facts, it would turn society upside down, literally. Some may not think it, but if you dont, think of this, would you feel totally safe letting your 6 year old play in your backyard that borders woods while you did the dishes, knowing that a 12 foot enormous animal lives in your area. While some say they may not care and that they are harmless, i seriously doubt people would feel totally secure. It is a kind of upsetting when you think of it.

Again i mean no offense to anyone, i believe everyone should have their own opinion and everyones opinion matters. But if you truly cant understand why a gov would get involved almost assuredly, then you may want to read the document that is posted i believe on here. It is an official USFW document stating procedure on what to do when the discovery is made. It hints at what would at first be done and what great effect it would have. It would be a major governmental isssue. At least i firmly believe so, but i could be completely wrong. I hope we will all find out very soon.

i dont understand why everyone is now doubting this story and Dr. Ketchums results whatever they may be when at first they believed it. (only talking to those for who it applies). I dont understand what has made is so unbelievable with the many stories that have been released, or what credibility if any has been taken away. Or why this whole thing is rediculous.

If this story is true, which it seems to be on some level, their would be many different stories, afterall as the story is told around and becomes more public, different people will tell different things but yet the story will probably remain similar in its punch line. This would happen for alot of differnet reasons. Some people may be ellaborating and details may be wrong here and there but this story has remained consistant ever since it broke. Not only that but numerous organizations have backed it up saying that a shooting did happen, but not ellaborating. If this were just a fictitious tale, it would be shot down pretty quick as most hoaxes and rumors are, and their wouldnt be organizations that arent related coming forward acknowledging it. afterall the basic story has been, a dude was hunting bear, shot 2 bigfeet, one baby one adult, and thats it. What he did with them, who knows. Does ketchum have some of their remains, who knows. Was it illegal, who knows, but one thing that has stayed the same is that their was a shooting. The players are turning out to be real people who are acknowledging that it happened not that it is a hoax.

Now is it real, i dont know, only a few people do at this point. But what is real is that their is the story and that its punch line isnt changing. what is real is that Ketchum who is a noted and respected scientist is working on a dna study of bigfoot with promising results. What is real is that biscardi is not involved. And what is real, is that just because people embelish here and there and add or remove facts, that doesnt mean that a story isnt true.

So before people start to get dissappointed and start to have their doubts, please think about the stages things would go through when concerning a major controversial study and story. What would be happening is what we have here. Lets hope that what we all want though happens. Just dont get dissapointed or loose interest yet. I really do believe that something is getting ready to break that is of a big nature.

Sierra Shooting

The only thing that sounds out of place (and this isn’t Derek’s fault) is the claim that when they returned for the bodies they found “a piece of flesh, greasy fat and hair.” I would think that would be an extremely rare find given the number of scavengers in the wild. Even rarer than shooting a Sasquatch.