doc, I’m not saying this is a Grizzly. That was just the article I found on bears and sagittal crest. In fact I believe the bears in question are Black Bears. All three of them. Momma and her two cubs. I guess it would be wierd if it were a grizzly. As I’m not sure to many grizzlies are in that neck of the woods. I may be wrong though, about Grizzlies in Pennsylvania. Wouldn’t be the first or last time.

not sure if you’re reading my posts. Read them again.

Whether or not bears have sagittal crests is IRRELEVANT TO THIS DISCUSSION.

A bear’s would not - does not, never did - yield the sighting phenomenon that it does in an ape. I. E.: you WOULD NOT SEE IT.

Period. Done.

From someone who knows a LOT about bears.

DWA responds:
November 1st, 2007 at 12:19 pm
I JUST read a new submission on the “when is a mangy bear a mangy bear?” thread that CONCLUSIVELY proclaims a sagittal crest.

Do bears have those?

DARHOP resopnds:

Grizzly Bears do.

Grizzly Bear Ursus arctos

The grizzly bear is a large mammal in the Ursidae family. The skull of a grizzly bear is extremely large with a broad, short rostrum. The large canine teeth and specialized pre-molar and molar teeth support its omnivorous diet. The sagittal crest is more developed in older individuals.
specimen information

Collected: 5 June 1988
Locality: Whitecourt, AB
Township: 59 Range: 13 W5
Latitude: 54° Longitude: -115.75°
Age: adult Sex: m ©2006 Royal Alberta

If the bear is looking toward the camera, the paws look awfully twisted.

1) I suspect the bear is twisting its paws and trying to resist the pressure of a cub underneath it. Because it is a snapshot we can’t know how long this awkward position was maintained.

2) I believe my hypothesized paw positioning is within the reasonable range of motion for bear paws with my hypothesized orientation. (At least the front paws. I don’t think there is enough detail in the rear paws to determine their orientation.)

Here’s my complaint about the idea that the head is that big round thing under the animal. If it is a head and the animal is facing the left, then it is bent at a terrific angle.
If it is a head and the animal is facing the camera, then its neck doesn’t appear to be connected to the spine, but has to come out of the chest or something. (There is a clear delineation between the inverted v-shape between the legs and the round shape. I’ve heard people say that sasquatch has no neck - but I’ve always assumed that meant the head was supposed to be plopped close to the shoulders - not that it literally had no neck.)

On the other hand, if my hypothesis is correct and it is a crappy photo of a bear facing the camera - then we’ve no more an exotic phenomena than bad photography.

I’m still not sure that the bear face I see is “really” there and not a trick of the camera, but I am sure that the creature is a bear.

I understand what you are saying. But to say that they ( bears ) do not have one is an incorrect statement in my opinion. That’s all.

1. Bears don’t have sagittal crests.

2. Anyone who can see a sagittal crest in those photos is seeing an APE.

Do I need to find the article again that says Bears do have a sagittal crest.
to prove my point. Or is it you just can’t admit when you are wrong ? Because it will only take me a few minutes to find an article saying bears have a sagittal crest. And I’m not talking about these photos. I’m talking about bears in general. They do have a sagittal crest. I posted the article on here before when we were on the sagittal crest subject. Obviously you did not see the article. I’ll see if I can find it again. Heck I’ll just look in the older post and see if I can find it there.

I’m not saying anything about seeing a sagittal crest myself. I’m replying to the people who are, and those who are saying that bears have them.

I may stand corrected that bears do not. But there is simply no visible observable effect (e.g. “conehead”) in a bear. It’s simply not a feature identifiable in a good look at a bear, as so many people have id’d it in sas sighting reports.

I hear people saying, so what if it’s a sagittal crest in those photos? bears have them.

If you can actually see one, you’re not describing a bear. THAT is my point. You might find one on a bear skull. But you won’t see one on a bear, any more than you can see fine details of bone structure looking at my face.