Gilroy Associate Attacks Cryptomundo As Tracks Announced
Posted by: Loren Coleman on April 29th, 2008
Rex Gilroy’s earlier Karumba, Australia, track find.
An individual only identifying himself as “ausiepath9,” who serves as a spokesperson for the Gilroys of Australia, is posting around the web that “Fresh Moa Tracks” have been discovered in New Zealand.
This associate shares this week that “Rex and Heather have returned from New Zealand and have many new discoveries to show” in the future, including “the Moa tracks Rex discovered.”
Ausiepath9 relates that a “few years back” Rex Gilroy “discovered a small scrub Moa track(s) [sic] up-to 20 in leaf-mould..of which two were cast.”
But the latest tracks are apparently different:
The latest tracks are of two large Moa’s [sic] and possibly a variety that was thought to be a separate species on both islands but could now be the same species. The large track I have seen were very impressive and matches exactly the Museum’s exhibition at Auckland showing tracks and the feet of all the species of Moa’s [sic], that Rex also filmed (at the museum) and showed at the meeting which I filmed. One of the tracks is the size of my arm-from my wrist to my elbow. The two side digits are present but only the inside half-the back pad is missing, lost in leaf mould. Rex was very fortunate that he could cast what he did.
In a potshot at Cryptomundo, then ausiepath9 launches into attack mode:
Many people online criticised Rex and his chances of success in new Zealand with the Moa. Just type in Google - Rex Gilroy Moa..It was like a frenzied shark attack. Fortunately the majority only commented on the actual expedition itself.
One large Crypto site (which surprised me that the post was allowed to be on there as the person who owns the site is a cryptozoologist himself - and even asked for a free copy of his Rex’s crypto book) even allowed posters to demean and insinuate that they wouldn’t trust anything Rex discovered, before he even left for New Zealand..talk about calling the kettle black. These people are not researchers they are very nasty people.
Since it is the Cryptomundo posts that have most publicized Gilroy’s NZ trip, they are the ones that come to the top when you “google” the topic. Thus Cryptomundo is being attacked. Is the criticism of this site fair? Let’s look at the facts.
Well, with all due respect, I do not “own” Cryptomundo; I am merely the primary blogger here.
I admit, of course, to asking for courtesy copies of books if people want me to review them. As most reviewers know, these are technically not “free copies,” as a reviewer’s posting of such a mention and links to a book on a website read by 2 million people is the “payment.” I did submit for a review copy of Gilroy’s new Yowie book (written after Healy’s and Cropper’s The Yowie was published) to critique and promote it here. No review copies of any books have ever been forwarded to me from Mr. Gilroy.
As to my past announcement about the forthcoming Gilroy Moa hunt in New Zealand at Cryptomundo, my reportage was without commentary or opinion, gave the facts straightforwardly, and did not demean Mr. Gilroy, at all. As to the comment makers remarking on that posting, only one in ten gave a negative opinion of Mr. Gilroy’s quest, but it was hardly raised to the level of a flaming that needed to be deleted.
In my followup story on the Gilroy hunt (here), I only documented the New Zealand cryptozoologist Tony Lucas’ thoughts on the forthcoming New Zealand search, which had everything to do with the locations being surveyed and nothing about the personality of Rex Gilroy.
The comments below that followup posting took on the flavor of a conversation between two posters, not a shark attack on Gilroy.
If ausiepath9 was a little less sensitive about the perception of criticism of Rex Gilroy, and a little more forthright with the evidence allegedly available from Mr. Gilroy, the rightful focus would be on the cryptids and not the cryptozoologists. Or this blog.
Is there breaking news out of New Zealand, regarding the Gilroy quest? Once again, we find it is wrapped in a defensive announcement from the Rex Gilroy camp that has little to do with cryptozoology.
Make available the evidence for analyses, and silence your critics. Take the politics out of cryptozoology.
a “few years back” Rex Gilroy “discovered a small scrub Moa track(s) [sic] up-to 20 in leaf-mould..of which two were cast.”
OK, where are those casts? Where is the report on them? What independent scientists have been contacted to provide opinions? These are fair questions - no attack meant.
Agreed, MattBille. It’s basic scientific procedure to have your discoveries verified independently.
As for the “attacks”
“the person who owns the site is a cryptozoologist himself - and even asked for a free copy of his Rex’s crypto book) even allowed posters to demean and insinuate that they wouldn’t trust anything Rex discovered”
“even ALLOWED posters…”?? Sounds like the problem isn’t with you, Loren, or the site itself. Sounds like this guy is miffed because people stated their opinions in the comments forum. Would anything less than unmitigated praise have been sufficient to appease him?
I agree with you, Loren, when you say that had he been less sensitive to outside criticism and more focused on the work … C’est la vie, right?
ausiepath9 is either Rex or it sounds to me to be someone he may want to put a restraining order against. This person is obsessed with Rex. There is nothing wrong with people voicing their opinions about such things. There has been a pattern in the crypto world that we recognize–when people make claims without showing their “evidence” things are fishy. I would be overjoyed if/when he finds the Moas, but until then this kinda smells like the Johor big foot incident, “We have pictures! Here is a sketch of the picture…Okay, here’s the picture…Ooops, we didn’t know…” (that is just a summary of the Johor incident). If Rex is just as sensitive as ausiepath9, then he may want to look into another career. Cryptozoology is a major target/magnet for criticism, even from within. After all it is a science, therefore we need to review the evidence, and not just go by our deepest desires and beliefs that these different creatures actually do exist.
I’m not familiar with the Gilroy quest; but it does sound like to me that ausiepath9 needs to take a step back and a deep breath, and then learn the definition of a “blog” and the definition of “cricital appraisal”.
I agree, I read the 10 comments made by Cryptomundians and only one talked about Gilroy himself, the others remained either skeptical or hopeful; in other words, the typical Cryptomundo response.
I honestly think ausiepath9’s rant was uncalled for. But I think he should be the one to explain what he feels was an unfair attack against Gilroy. This is after all a free and open forum, right?
Sounds to me like ausipath9 needs to take a couple of deep breaths, getting bent over constructive criticism and plain old honest opinion is just down right childish. I went back and read the entire blog entry and the comments and I found nothing that would be considered demeaning to Mr. Gilroy.
The people that leave comments on this web site are very knowledgeable and intelligent folks (excluding yours truly of course) and do not to stoop to the level ausipath9 seems to have. Good luck in your endeavors ausipath9, good luck indeed.
Oh yeah I almost forgot, what evidence?
Read the previous linked posts.
Opinions were expressed. This site is criticised because of one perceived negative opinion ? Rather excessive.
Please note the Ausiepath9 critic obviously read the posts and chose not to refute the opinion or present information to show error in the opinion.
This site is populated with inciteful, intelligent and thoughtful posters whose opinions which are shared with civility. Singular agreement is not necessary. I have seen posters diagree on one blog and be in agreement on another. In the blogging world this is as good as it gets.
I do not feel that Cryptomundo or Loren needs to be defended since the opinion of Ausiepath9 is unfounded and unwarranted but since silence can be perceived as approval I chose to post.
Loren, in anything of yours I’ve ever read you have always tried to be objective and respectful, even when you obviously disagree with findings or procedure.
My post above should read in the last sentence “critical appraisal”, not “cricital”. See, I can even acknowledge my own mistakes and I’m not afraid to admit it on a blog.
Welcome to the world of cryptozoology! lol
Seriously if you’re going to be in this field better be ready for criticism and if you cant take the heat get out of the kitchen! I know! I’ve personally already gone through it on a smaller scale and needed to overcome it, all in a certain time period of course, as they say time heals all wounds. The more one gets involved and gets to know other cryptozoologist or so called experts in this field, the more one sees the world of cryptozoology is just like everything else, high school all over again! I can only hope Rex keeps his chin up and keeps on searching whether the feedback is positive or negative.
The in-fighting in the crypto community is unreal. Over the years there appears to be 2 camps that have taken one side or another.
Rex Gilroy is berated by those who say that giant lizards cannot exist & yet expouse a theory that the Yowie, Australia’s bigfoot is a true, living, breathing animal without any scientific proof or fossil record to support it.
Megalania actually existed.
No wonder the mainstream scientific community doesn’t take us seriously.
Unless cryptozoologists change their attitude in their persistance that every unknown creature can be explained as a living dinosaur, then the science will fade into obscurity.
Has anyone wondered why there has been no new definitive cryto book that has been published within the last 10 years that concerntrates on taking the subject forward, 99% of the books go over regurgitatedold reports that bring nothing new.
What should be happening is applying, investigating & matching old reports with current scientific thinking to prove that cryptozoolgy has a poistive role to play in todays world.
The colossal squid that is currently being examined by a team of scientists
is suppose to be a juvenile, as this squid doesn’t seem to suffer the same buoyancy problems as Architeuthis, then this may give weight to this squid attacking boats in the past.
There is also the MonsterQuest evidence of a giant squid 60′+ videoed in the sea of Cortez which would be a 1st for either Architeuthis or the colossal squid. Unless it is a giant version of the Humboldt squid.
well said and agreed.
but then, that would mean setting aside the personality wars in favor of doing the dirty, in-the-field, scientifically tedious job of analysis vs. opinion and facts vs. factoids in context, right?
oh well, it was a good idea…
When some people are attacked, they get all emotional and act as if they or their pet Sojourner After Truth are on an island surrounded by sharks.
When others are attacked, they calmly trot out more evidence.
Guess which ones I pay attention to?
The conflict and disagreements that arise within cryptozoology are no different - and certainly no worse - than the conflicts that arise in any branch of mainstream science. Read any of the recent news items relating to the Flores hobbit controversy to see that our field is not unique!
In Australia, Rex Gilroy certainly polarises the cryptozoological community; he has his strong supporters and vocal detractors. He certainly feels persecuted - his last self-published book (’The Yowie Mystery’) contains page upon page of (thinly veiled) barbs targeted at just about every other yowie researcher in the country. Interestingly, while other books on the yowie mystery (Malcolm Smiths, mine and Tony Healy’s) mention and acknowledge other active local researchers, Rex’s books only ever seem to mention…Rex!
And to yetimead, I’d add that I have serious doubts that the giant lizard stories are a legitimate Australian cryptids. I’ve been in the field in Australia for 30 years and I’ve never come across an old report or modern witness in any of my travels. Makes you think!
I agree that it is very difficult to believe that Megalania is alive, well & running through the Australian bush.
My point is that instead of arguing about these creatures we should be carrying out investigations to see whether creatures currently exist that could match these reports.
For example;
Chinese Wildman - the orangutan’s distribution was spread over vast tracts of asia in the not too distant past & is a strong possibilty that unknown pockets of these creatures could have survived to the present day in China.
Why does the crypto community insist that this creature is Gigantopithecus blacki when we don’t even know if it was bidpedal, yes, if it was then may fit the some eye witness reports, if not, should it be ruled out.
Unfortunately the politics of the cryptozoological community have to force the identification of Gigantopithecus blacki on the rest of the community as it is a current favourite for the identification of Bigfoot & it is certainly a big money spinner!
Other eye witness reports for the wildman include witnesses describing it as big, round bellied with red hair which describes an orang.
Bigfoot - I’m sorry but the Patterson film looked a fake back in the 70s, isn’t it interesting that he actively went looking for it & managed to find one, producing the only bit of tangible evidence to show up in years.
Motion detectors, infra red cameras have produced nothing since - willing something to exist I’m afraid just doesn’t cut it with the mainstream science community.
hell yeah yetimead!!!
“Why does the crypto community insist that this creature is Gigantopithecus blacki when we don’t even know if it was bidpedal”
And all this based on a few teeth and jaw bones! LMAO
I totally agree with you on that Gianganto theory and hate the fact that people just seem to agree with it without knowing much about Gianganto!
Regarding the PG footage! I used to 100% believe the footage was legit but now I’m no longer sure?!? I can only say that the vocalizations I’ve experienced (would be hard for a human to do) and the hand print and feet prints I’ve come across (unless done by a human to fool me, which would be really tricky aswell due to the dermal ridges and depth of the prints in the type of earth they were done in, it whatever it was had to weigh a whole lot) seems to me that the PG footage is a fake! As you’ve mentionned he went looking for it and after 40 years and all our current technology we cant even come close! If I hadnt experienced my own experience I would right off this whole phenomenon as being a hoax!
As long as his forearm? Is a mid-scale tyrannasaurid running about New Zealand?